A Conversation with Andrew Mackintosh

It’s a great thrill and privilege this episode to welcome multi-talented actor, writer and music artist, Andrew Mackintosh, who carved his own special niche in British television history as Detective Sergeant Alistair Greig, a key character in over 300 episodes of one of the most successful and influential television dramas of all time, The Bill.

But as we discover, there’s so much more to his varied career, encompassing acting, music and writing. We learn about Andrew’s current project, the hit fiction podcast, Letter From Helvetica, talk about his early life and how his professional journey in music and acting began, and he shares with us some of his creative influences.

We explore his continuing musical collaboration with Joe Dooley, and get to grips with some general acting and career matters, including authenticity in casting, accents, received pronunciation and the art of speech, and the mixed blessing of being in a long-running series. We also discuss opportunities for mature actors and, inspired by an unstoppable generation of rock and roll performers, if perceptions of age are evolving in a positive way within the arts and beyond.

Selected content guide for fans of The Bill:

(24:07) Casting – (29:39) DS Greig’s accent – (34:02) Main segment: Remembering Kevin Lloyd, script quality, cast and character dynamic, notable guest artists and production anecdotes – (57:30) Social and political awareness and activity – (1:21:18) Effect on career

(These times apply to the YouTube presentation. Listeners on other platforms may notice a slight variance)

As DS Alistair Greig. Character profile at thebillfandom.com

Listen on SoundCloud

Companion Newsletter

Andrew Mackintosh and fellow luminary of The Bill, Natalie Roles, in Andrew’s latest creation, the hit fiction podcast, Letter From Helvetica.
(Image: Letter From Helvetica -Media and Press)

We begin our conversation learning about Andrew’s current ongoing project, the Apple Top 40 fiction podcast, Letter From Helvetica, written by and starring Andrew himself, and also starring fellow legend of The Bill, Natalie Roles (who played DS Debbie McAllister). As Andrew explains, Letter from Helvetica is based upon his epistolary novel, the story told through an exchange of emails;

“…The Letter from Helvetica Podcast follows the adventures of Abigail Wesley, a talented young botanist who is spending a year on the ever-so-slightly-made-up island of Burbango in the island nation of Vanuatu in the South Pacific, and her Uncle John, an acerbic retired Lieutenant Colonel who lives in the not-quite-real village of Helvetica in Cornwall…”

Andrew’s interest in, and affection for, Vanuatu, which shines through in his writing and Natalie Roles’ hypnotic performance as Abby, was sparked by an encounter with Peter Walker, the co-director of the Wan Smolbag theatre group, which has expanded beyond drama to encompass critical medical, community and environmental work across Vanuatu. Find out more at their official website.

Letter From Helvetica is produced by Oliver Crocker, and can been streamed free on SoundCloud or wherever you get your podcasts. It’s a highly enjoyable, gentle comedy and a great ‘comfort listen’. You’ll also find lots of interesting background on the Letter From Helvetica website, including links to social media, and how you can be part of the Helvetica family by supporting the production.

In terms of writing influences, Andrew cites and recommends Lake Wobegon Days by Garrison Keillor and the Radio Four comedy, Ed Reardon’s Week, which can be streamed from BBC podcasts.

Letter From Helvetica showcases Andrew’s gift for voices, a talent he has been able to put to good use beyond his television work, including narrating Pure Dead Magic by Debi Gliori, for both audiobook and BBC radio adaptations.

During our discussion on whether the pure art of voice and speech remains an integral and/or necessary part of an actor’s professional development, Andrew observes that the teaching of iambic pentameter appears to have gone by the wayside.

“…We were taught to understand why Shakespeare wrote in iambic pentameter for most of the time, how it helps you, as an actor, to move from one thought to another…”

Encyclopedia Britannica defines iambic pentameter as ‘a line of verse composed of ten syllables arranged in five metrical feet (iambs), each of which consists of an unstressed syllable followed by a stressed syllable. The line can be rhymed, as in sonnets or heroic couplets (pairs of end-rhymed lines found in epic or narrative poetry), or unrhymed, as in blank verse’. Link to the complete article, including historical examples, here.

A definitive Sun Hill CID lineup
Image: The Irish Mirror

Andrew recalls his early television experiences in Coronation Street, Poirot, and the epic 1988 Cold War drama, Game, Set and Match, shot in some frighteningly authentic locations.

He also appeared in Every Breath You Take, a one-off television play by Nell Dunn, writer of social realism classics Poor Cow and Up The Junction, which featured Connie Booth and a young Charlie Condou, who went on to great success in Coronation Street and beyond.

The producers of The Bill had a particular (and perhaps improbable) set of criteria in mind when they conceived the character of DS Alistair Greig, all of which, to their surprise, Andrew managed to satisfy. The young, clarinet-playing Scottish detective joined Sun Hill CID in 1989.

Actress Linda Regan who, according to IMDb, appeared in five episodes of The Bill between 1988 and 1998, once observed that The Bill provided so much work for actors in guest roles, it was known in the trade as ‘National Service’.

The Billaton, a highly recommended and comprehensive information website, sets out some of the notable names who appeared.

Guest artists (1980s) Guest Artists (1990s)

An intense two-hander with Bronagh Gallagher in Somebody Special (1992)

Two memorable guest artists Andrew recalls were Bronagh Gallagher, and Charles Kay. Bronagh Gallagher’s appearance in Somebody Special (1992), highlighted how DS Greig’s style contrasted with some of the bigger personalities in CID like Frank Burnside (Christopher Ellison) and Ted Roach (Tony Scannell). The mix of very different characters and a team ethic within the ensemble cast, backed up by high quality scripts, made it a wholly believable, multifaceted and authentic workplace.

Andrew says;

“…The writing was awfully good…You would read your script when it came through the door and would just go, ah this is great, there’s so much to get your teeth into here…How lucky we were, to essentially be part of repertory theatre on TV. The policy was not to bring in stars, the policy was to use actors who had stagecraft…that knew their art…and that kept that dynamic strong…”

Charles Kay (born 1930) as Tsar Nicholas II in the 1974 BBC docudrama, Fall of Eagles. His remarkable career spanned seven decades, including three appearances in The Bill between 1990 and 1997.

Andrew reminisces fondly about working closely with the supremely talented Kevin Lloyd, who played the likeable and hardworking everyman, DC Tosh Lines, in 458 episodes from 1988 to 1998.
He sadly passed away in 1998, aged just 49.

After a decade and 333 episodes, in 1998 the character of DS Greig was eased out amid moves to change the programme’s style and direction. Andrew talks in greater detail about his departure from The Bill and what followed, in his interview with Oliver Crocker at The Bill Podcast:

Andrew Mackintosh – The Bill Podcast interview.

Two albums by Andrew and his long-standing musical collaborator, Joe Dooley, are available to stream on Spotify and other platforms. Find out more at their official website, bloodygoodmusic.co.uk.

We discuss a selection of tracks, beginning with the stunningly beautiful soundscape of acoustic guitar and vocal harmony, Bonne Nuit Bay, written by Joe Dooley. We then look at two of Andrew’s compositions; Road Out of Darkness, a cautionary tale about the seductive yet vapid nature of fame and of coming out the other side, which Andrew describes as a ‘kicking against celebrity’, and the political protest anthem, Caravan, inspired by Andrew’s time in Liverpool in the turbulent 1980s, working at the Everyman Theatre.

Asked about early musical influences and favourites, Andrew recalls a childhood love of Marc Bolan and T-Rex, and then an affinity for prog rock and complex music and lyrics, and artists like Genesis, Queen and 10CC. He also recalls the life-changing revelation of hearing Bruce Springsteen’s Born to Run for the first time.

“…I was fortunate that I was exposed to classical music a lot…and jazz as well, and I was always interested in guitarists because that was my main instrument; there’s a jazz guitarist called Pat Metheney who is one of the very best, has a massive amount of output, he just writes and writes…he’s an exceptional jazz guitarist and I’ve been listening to him since I was pretty young…”

Anthony Andrews and Jeremy Irons in Brideshead Revisited, one of many ambitious and quality productions by Granada during a golden age of television drama

Andrew references the acclaimed performances of Anthony Andrews and Jeremy Irons in Granada’s Brideshead Revisited (1981), as an early source of inspiration. He was also captivated by political theatre, particularly the 7:84 Theatre Group, so named because at that time in Scotland, seven percent of the population held 84 percent of the wealth. There’s a little background on 7:84 at the website of the University of Glasgow Library.

Of the magic of theatre more generally, Andrew says;

“…I must have been 14 or 15 years old, seeing a cast arrive in some small theatre and go into the backstage area; to me they were walking through a magic portal. This is the only place I wanted to be, I wanted to be able to walk through that portal as well…Much later on working in theatres, remembering that thought as I walked through that magic portal, and remembering what a privilege it was to do what I did…“

Now busy with a number of works in progress including a novel, Andrew declares his intention of going on for decades yet, stressing the importance of staying physically and mentally fit as you get older, and avoiding the temptation of just ‘slipping into old age’. It’s an uplifting and optimistic sentiment to end on, as we look forward to celebrating the 20th anniversary of Letter From Helvetica in 2043!

We do hope you enjoyed our conversation. Very special thanks to Andrew for being so generous with his time, and to Oliver Crocker for making this episode possible.

Sample Reels

Top: Remembering Kevin Lloyd, and a (very) fleeting appearance in Poirot.

Bottom: The Bill scripts, being cast as DS Greig, and a location winnebago mixup.

Further Media and Related Content

Letter from Helvetica – media coverage and image gallery

Oliver Crocker’s The Bill Podcast is the definitive oral history of The Bill, told by the people who made it. Listen on SoundCloud, YouTube, and wherever you get your podcasts. You can also subscribe on Patreon to access an extensive vault of exclusive content.

Books about The Bill (Published by Devonfire Books)